Comments on: The Jesus Quote You’ll Never Hear in Church

By: Gloria

Gloria — Thu, 31 Dec 2009 15:19:32 +0000

Which Church have you attended? I heard (and read) these quotes many times.
What is your point? My LORD is not a broken king. He will trample His enemy under His heel

By: Lawrie

Lawrie — Wed, 18 Nov 2009 20:34:20 +0000

Daniel,
What do you gain if the Bible or Christianity be proved false?

Interesting, you presumed I am not a Christian simply because I was articulate and respectful of you. This doesn’t offend me. Does it demonstrate you may have some very deep prejudices affecting your core belief system? Did you carefully read my reply to your article? Do you accept that perhaps you could be wrong?
I appreciate your appreciation of my reply, but I wonder if there is really any room for discussion. (?)

So, shame on you Daniel for your assumption? Shame on you for what appears to be an unwillingness to seek to gain real understanding of the scripture you malign? Hmmm we shall see.

Actually, I am a believer and follower of the living God. I absolutely believe Jesus Christ is fully God and was both fully God and man while he walked this earth. I believe God is both righteous judge and loving father. I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God and it may be trusted as stated in 2 Timothy 3:16 “All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness”. Does that surprise you?

That being said…..yes, I have found people are generally ignorant their own foundational beliefs and also of language and history. Unfortunately, people tend to do exactly what you do, which is to misquote scripture for their own purposes. Perhaps their intentions are in earnest but the result is always the same, a twisting of truth. I don’t think that is isolated to Christians.

The reality is becoming a Christian does not magically remove all flaw-this isn’t CandyLand. Rather Paul describes Christianity as a marathon race, we continually move toward the goal of following our master to become more like Him. In CS Lewis’ book Mere Christianity, Ch 32 “Nice people or New men” he presents an answer to his own question, “If Christianity is true why are not all Christians obviously nicer than all non-Christians?” his conclusion is complex but well worth reading. I won’t spoil the ending for you. Just remember, the British have been stereotyped in the past for having bad teeth.

Sadly, some people do resort to anger and name-calling instead of properly defending their beliefs. Some, perceiving their ideals under unjust attack, may choose to punch (figuratively) their attacker in the nose for his opinion. Consider their opponent so absurd, reckless, socially or intellectually inferior as to be beneath them and simply talk about them. Respond to what is perceived of as an outrageous effort to gain attention and offer a contemptuous or demeaning blow to curb the tongue (i.e. whack a dog on the nose to stop his barking). Or perhaps, disdainful, offer no reply at all … complete disregard. “Bad press is better than none”, is the saying. Say….at least you know you’re being read. 

Do you disagree with the way God handled situations in this book or what God considers sin?

In terms of exercising control over the freedom, will, or thought of others; God offers us the ultimate free will. The bible clearly states that not only are we set free, but we are never to lord-it over others.

You say your aim is to prove the Bible is totalitarian and negative and that requires no spin. I can accept you believe that, however, I clearly disagree. The Bible is full of the harsh realities of life, no sugarplums and gumdrops there….God clearly defines the consequences of our choices but in no way insists that we obey Him-He didn’t even insist that the angels choose Him. He offers two choices…choose Him and you get to be with Him for all eternity –Heaven. Don’t choose him and you get to be away from Him for all eternity- Hell. Is it that you want a third choice….i.e. Do what you want the way you want it, then reap the rewards of those who did obey…..That’s a bit narcissistic.

I guess I wonder:
1. Are your words designed to justify your own lifestyle?
2. Did someone use this book to injure you?
3. Why is it so important to you that others reject this book?
And finally,
4. If your arguments are not based upon fact, (meaning, you are misinterpreting scripture based upon wrong belief on your part), are you willing to reexamine this book?

By: Daniel Miessler

Daniel Miessler — Thu, 12 Nov 2009 20:57:29 +0000

Thanks for the comment. Coents from belivers are much less articulate
and much more rude.

My goal is to show that the bible is totalitarian and negative rather
than what it's taught as. Nothing more than the truth. No need for spin.

Your own summary of the piece captured it nicely.

By: Lawrie

Lawrie — Thu, 12 Nov 2009 20:10:55 +0000

Daniel,
Regarding Luke 19:27. I don't believe you are crazy or stupid. I enjoy a good argument, but it must be a real argument, one for grownups and not fairytales for children. I enjoy your thought process, however its clear your agenda may not be deeper understanding of a complex God but rather proving your reasons for not obeying Him. Psalm 14:1 “The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God "They are corrupt, they have committed abominable deeds; There is no one who does good.” Ouch, God rarely pulls punches.

So, Daniel, why do you read the Bible at all? Is your point its dangerous, irrelevant, useless and must be exposed? Ok, I can accept that position. Or are you intentionally creating a straw-man argument, insisting verses means one thing then setting out to destroy those false ideas to promote a personal agenda. Hmm that sounds a bit more dark.

Do you understand Hermeneutics? Do you have a basic understanding of Jewish teaching and historic monarchy where a king literally held the power over life and death? A reader must understand a story’s cultural significance to its original hearers within the context of the writing and understanding of the time or interpretation is irrelevant and infantile. I don’t rewrite history and literature to make myself feel better…..do you? That would be arrogant, would it not?

You repeatedly take scripture out of context. Do you lack understanding of historical or cultural significance? What’s the significance of Jesus tying this parable directly to His interaction with Zacchaeus? What was happening right before the event in Luke 19:27? Bother to read that? Luke 19:11 starts “….because he (Jesus) was near Jerusalem and the people thought that the kingdom of God was going to appear at once." And Jesus then goes on to admonish the Jews with the king’s harsh wrath for his enemies. Every bit of the lead-in has significance....do you know what that is?

The passage clearly demonstrates even the Jews were as guilty of petulantly insisting God bring salvation in a way they thought acceptable…Just as you and rest of us are (Gods says drunkenness, selfishness, lying, homosexuality and promiscuity are wrong….well, I disagree, so I will discredit the Bible or reinterpret His word to mean what I want it to mean). Rather then just admitting we're choosing a lifestyle in opposition to the living God and therefore choosing to separate ourselves from Him (i.e. choosing Hell). Because...well... if there is a God and He is the God of the Bible and we choose to disobey and walk away from Him, then crap! we are in deep trouble aren't we.

We all seek to usurp God’s authority and sovereign guidance in our lives….that is why He demands complete and total capitulation from us…We are at war with God in our hearts and the only way to gain entrance to His presence is for us to lay down our arms. God is already aware of our corrupt and abominable deeds, even those done in secret. Yet He strangely insists we acknowledge them before approaching His throne. Hmmm, why would He do that....that meanie!

Consider this as a point: As Jews, (beloved nation of God’s chosen people, set apart for the purpose of bringing about the salvation of the world through a Messiah sent by God), even they, could be considered enemies of God when they refused to accept Him/Jesus as their rightful king.

Basically the passage is God saying, "I don't care how right you think you are. When you insist on your will above mine...you're heading for trouble".

By: johnathanrdrake

johnathanrdrake — Wed, 11 Nov 2009 02:37:01 +0000

You're wacked out…sorry to say…you find ONE passage where Jesus is speaking and he is saying what the ruler says to the wicked servant and you attribute evil to the heart of Jesus…that's why he put the scripture in their about “wresting the scriptures”. read that sometime because you can “quote” him on that!

By: Marty

Marty — Mon, 11 May 2009 08:56:18 +0000

Your an idiot.

Luke 19:27 is a proverb; a parable. Its a story that illustrates a point.

Go back to Luke 19:11 and read forward to the end of Luke 19:27 to get the full context of the story.

By: Marty

Marty — Mon, 11 May 2009 04:56:18 +0000

Your an idiot.

Luke 19:27 is a proverb; a parable. Its a story that illustrates a point.

Go back to Luke 19:11 and read forward to the end of Luke 19:27 to get the full context of the story.

By: de-conversion

de-conversion — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 12:51:02 +0000

See this blog I started a couple years ago on this: http://literalbible.blogspot.com

By: jeph

jeph — Sun, 26 Apr 2009 14:19:07 +0000

dont forget matt 10:34

By: Falcor

Falcor — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 14:11:02 +0000

This is exactly what I was talking about. The debate just goes on and on and nobody gets anywhere, they just feel self-important to publicly display their opinion. Give it up. This is what makes me think that religion is only a form of population and mind control, and there is no truth to it whatsoever. How far have we advanced in the last 50-60 years??? Yet we still discuss this bullshit like it matters. Die for your beliefs and go worship God on his golden throne in the clouds, or go kill random people and hump 72 virgins. Who the F! wants to hump virgins anyway? I've done it, not 72, but a couple. It's not that great. She complains and makes upset faces, you blow your load in like 30 seconds. Heaven better have some weed and video games if the only other thing is 72 virgins… And Taco Bell. Beef Gordita Supreme motha clucka!!!

By: Jesus

Jesus — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 14:01:26 +0000

Why are random Words of yours Being capitalized At the Beginning? just Curious…

By: SekiraO_O

SekiraO_O — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 03:13:29 +0000

I don't think it's fair to say that Muslims are sons of Satan. Yes, the majority of them don't see Jesus as the son of God, but this is the result of vast misinformation and misunderstanding. Rather then accusing these people, we should learn from the strength of their faith and conviction and make sure to inform them of what we truely believe and why.

In the end, I think people who do believe in the one God should unite against Atheist and Polytheistic (irresponsable) world views.

By: kron3007

kron3007 — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 04:18:48 +0000

"Reason would inform you that your personal survival and best interests are the most important. This is the key to natural selection (an observed fact, right?). Reason would then tell you that other peoples interests (unless it is also beneficial to you) are less important."

Natural selection is not as simple as that. If you are a social animal, as humans are, altruistic acts that help the "pack" will increase everyones chance of survival. This can effectively increases your individual fitness and will be selected for. Altruism is not uncommon in the animal world, specifically with pack animals.

"Human beings, as far as I know, are the only species on the planet that routinely display compassion. This compassion very often is in complete opposition to what "reason" would tell them they should do (e.g. a person running into a burning building to rescue a non-relative)."

You have obvously not looked hard enough then. Compassionate acts are not limited to our species. The best example that I can think of happens in elephants. If an elephant is injured or weak and can not keep up with the pack, based on your logic the rest should sally forth and leave them beind. However, instead they slow their pace to allow the lame animal to keep pace, often extending the period thatthey will all go without water.

All in all, compassion and morality are not limited to humans, and can be easily explained through natural selection. Was there no morality before Jesus? Obviously there was, so it must be a trait that was quired during our evolution into our current form.

By: kron3007

kron3007 — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 03:47:43 +0000

"(in fact, Christians are forbidden to pass judgment on the souls of others)"

That is rich.

By: casey

casey — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 23:24:38 +0000

“the cock-sure atheists”

Just keep in mind that most atheists are agnostic, not “cock sure.” They don't claim to “know” god does not exist, they simply can't force themselves to believe a claim without evidence. So-called “agnostics” are confused about what their label means: they don't believe in god, but are apparently afraid to be called “atheist” (which just means someone who doesn't believe in gods). Agnostic means “without knowledge,” in this case, without knowledge of the existence of god. And that is a fact, not an opinion. If you want my opinion, it is that atheists have the most intellectual integrity of all the groups you mention, plus “agnostics.”

By: casey

casey — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 23:15:58 +0000

This is a false premise. Some people can be convinced by reason and strong arguments. As a de-convert from religion and superstition, I am living proof of this. It is for this reason that criticizing belief is a good thing to do. Without people on the outside making good arguments against belief, some people with logical minds would be trapped in belief systems because they were raised in them. Should they be given no resources for understanding the true nature of their beliefs?

By: Invader Kap

Invader Kap — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 15:00:39 +0000

God created the universe. That is all that we know about Him, because that is His definition. For all we know, He could be the Big Bang. In fact, if you believe in the Big Bang, He IS the Big Bang. All this other crud is faith. Even science requires faith; faith that everything we see before us is not an illusion created by Him to make us believe in science because He is in fact evil. Unless He isn't. Nothing can be scientifically proven because we don't scientifically "know" anything. It's all statistics; just because one plus one has equaled two throughout one-hundred percent of the known history of the universe doesn't mean that it always will. One day, someone might have an apple, get another apple, and magically and inexplicably end up with three apples, the final one having appeared at no discernable point in time but rather having always been there, just as though they had just added two apples. The law of gravity has been applied since the beginning of time, but the only things that say that it will never go out are mathematics, the law of gravity itself, and other laws of science based on mathematics and observations (and possibly that one thus-far-missing particle that supposedly causes gravity). Our observations can't necessarily be trusted. So you see, we don't "know" anything, and therefore we don't "know" that God doesn't exist. Maybe these people just interpreted the observations differently. Maybe there is NO correct interpretation of the observations; maybe God exists within us and we see these things because we are internally forcing ourselves to see a nonexistent universe, but that's okay, because we don't exist either. Maybe. You know what? Don't listen to me. I'm crazy.

By: caroline

caroline — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 21:13:42 +0000

How stupid you are. This "quote" you claim was made by Jesus was actually a cherry picked scripture from WITHIN one of Jesus's parables in which he was quoting SOMEONE ELSE.

Now read John 8:44 and here what Jesus actually DOES say about people like you.

By: The Jesus Quote You’ll Never Hear in Church | Bits & Pieces

The Jesus Quote You’ll Never Hear in Church | Bits & Pieces — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 19:06:15 +0000

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By: mae

mae — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 08:57:37 +0000

...And, why, an important subject is said in parable ? Why jesus need 10 sentences while actually he can say the gist in one sentence.

Considering that jesus is a 'god', i think he, as god, is not that wise.

By: Christopher Wing

Christopher Wing — Wed, 15 Apr 2009 21:42:54 +0000

Then he had gay sex. It's in the bible…

By: Falcor

Falcor — Wed, 15 Apr 2009 11:08:18 +0000

I would argue that the dominant religions have in their ancient texts of the old times, when God spoke to us, passages of the same effect. And why not? Who else but God, (Christian, Muslim, or otherwise), could tell his creation to do what he says, and that to disobey him is to bring eternal damnation on yourself? Or that those who would not follow him are enemies of God and allies of Satan? But these posts, like the seemingly millions of others on the internet, only serve as kindling to the bonfire that this tired and shallow argument has become. You have the blind christians and the deaf and dumb right wing types vs. the proud liberals and the cock-sure atheists and it goes on and on and blah and blah.
"Everyone's got an opinion, and everyone thinks it matters."
I want to talk about a gun-toting, shark-surfing bear. Does that not just blow your mind?

By: Kenneth Appleton

Kenneth Appleton — Tue, 14 Apr 2009 09:30:07 +0000

Just what is needed, more hate and more intolerance. Please note the sarcasm if you haven't already. Strange as it may seem, telling Christians or believers in any other faith such as Islam or Buddhism that they are wrong for believing what they believe will not cause them to lose their faith and start applying the same standards you do to determine what to believe. No it only makes them more defensive and sometimes more intolerant. If you think you need to speak out about some intolerable act you think they are doing why not criticize the act rather than the believe?

By: dScof

dScof — Tue, 14 Apr 2009 08:06:07 +0000

i'm not a religious man, nor one of faith, but i have to side with armorguy.

my take on it is this:

this parable is a means to relate that one should embrace their talents, and develop them into skills so that they may be used to better oneself, and thus, the community in which they interact, making it stronger and more resolvent as a whole. when a person fails to take advantage of their gifts, or even worse, fails to recognize their gifts, they force themselves into a limited existence and may indeed fail quite often when "judgment" (read also: opportunity to better oneself) comes.

By: Alex

Alex — Tue, 14 Apr 2009 07:15:04 +0000

You'd have to read the whole passage in context to get the correct interpretation. It's how any literary work is interpreted. If you take random quotes from Shakespeare's body of work without understanding the context it's taken from, you'll most likely misinterpret its meaning.

Any cult that comes along and interprets these passages as a call to violence would be as wrong as you. Your assumption is also incorrect that these passages are unknown to most Christians. Most Christians are familiar with the parables of Jesus; most have read the Book of Revelation. Even you know of these passages and you don't even go to church. So, these passages can't be as obscure as you think.